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Post by Jerrymac on May 13, 2010 3:20:22 GMT -5
I seem to have a really strange problem with my Blackhawk 450. Took it out the other day and just got it about 4 feet in the air, and the motor quit. No smoke, no burning smell, it just plopped to the ground. I plugged a spare motor from one of my K2's up to the esc, and nothing. So then I plugged in a spare esc from a K2 in the RX and the spare K2 motor , and still nothing. The aileron servo also does not move with any stick movements. So now I am thinking the RX must have crapped out. Anybody ever have a fairly new AR6200 do this? I thought about rebinding to see if the motor spins up, but no reason for the servo to quit at the same time either.   |
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Post by dunkonu23 on May 13, 2010 19:36:10 GMT -5
I'd rebind, then check it out. You have other spektrum receivers, so the cool thing is that you can swap them between models so as long as you are in the right model, you can bind that receiver to the model. What I'm getting at is this: You can temporarily move a receiver from another model to check your BH450 problem. When you're done checking, you can move it back to the original model, change the model in your transmitter and rebind.
Scott
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Post by Jerrymac on May 14, 2010 1:55:36 GMT -5
I think that is what I will do Saturday. I will rebind the rx that is in it now and see what happens. If that don't help I will pull an rx out of a King2 and try it in the Blackhawk.
It has an AR6200 in it now cause that is what I had at the time, but don't really need the satellite receiver in that size heli. I was hoping to take it out and use it for my 'next' build, but it might be toast.
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Post by dunkonu23 on May 14, 2010 23:28:49 GMT -5
Cool... About the only danger with doing that is ruining the swapped receiver, but it's probably very minimum.
Scott
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Post by Jerrymac on May 15, 2010 22:10:36 GMT -5
Well, I think I have multiple problems with the BH450. Today I tried re-binding and the servos all work. The motor will also now spin up with the spare King2 esc hooked to it, so, I quess the original esc must be bad. Just not sure why it would not spin up with the K2 esc before re-binding. Guess I will order another esc and see what happens, as the K2 esc is only a 25A and the motor is rated at 32A so it wouldn't last long if I tried to use it. EDIT; Geeez, I just spent 2 hours trying to find a new 40A esc of any brand, and can't find one in stock anywhere. Everybody lists them, but none in stock that I can find.  Guess I will have to open my own hobby shop so that I can get parts as it seems that nobody else wants to sell any.  |
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Post by dunkonu23 on May 16, 2010 0:42:55 GMT -5
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Post by Jerrymac on May 16, 2010 22:15:20 GMT -5
Scott, thanks for the links. Have you used the 35A Align esc? Does it hold up ok? As you may or may not remember, I have had 2 failures of Align electronics already on my Hurri 550, and 1 on my BH450.
I don't own any Trex helis, ( it is a personal thing that has nothing to do with the quality of the helicopters ), but I have used some Align branded electronics and they were not very reliable.
I found a cheapo Dynam 30A esc in my parts box. I put the heat sink from the stock BH esc on it and put it in the BH450 for a test flight today. I flew 3 packs with it and the heli flew great, but the esc got pretty hot. Need to get a 35A or higher I think.
Still think I might have an RX problem though. Even though the BH 450 flew awesome today, I noticed that the LED on the RX was flashing each time I landed. Never had that happen with any of my helis before. I don't think it is a problem with the TX, as I flew both Hurri's today and the RX's were not blinking on them.
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Post by billmay on May 16, 2010 22:23:57 GMT -5
Even though the BH 450 flew awesome today, I noticed that the LED on the RX was flashing each time I landed. Never had that happen with any of my helis before. I don't think it is a problem with the TX, as I flew both Hurri's today and the RX's were not blinking on them. Jerry, if that's a Spektrum RX then I believe the flashing RX is an indication that you lost communication with the TX momentarily at some point during the flight (assuming it was on solid when you first turned everything on). Bill |
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Post by dunkonu23 on May 17, 2010 0:53:43 GMT -5
Jerry,
Like Bill asked, was the light on solid when you first attached the battery? That's important because if you plug in the battery and unplug it without power cycling the transmitter, you'll get a flashing light. The flashing light generally indicates a brown out power wise. It can also flash if you get a static build up and subsequent discharge that may or may not cause a glitch. In general, if you see the light flashing when you're flying and you're sure it was solid before take off, it's probably a good idea to land right away.
Regarding align stuff. I've never had a problem with them. I have their ESC's in both my T-Rex 450 pro and T-Rex 500 ESP. I'm not the be all to end all with Electronics. Given a choice, I'd get a Castle over an Align any day.
Scott
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Post by Jerrymac on May 17, 2010 1:27:25 GMT -5
Bill and Scott, thanks for the reply. Yep, the rx had a steady lighted l.e.d. after plugging in the battery. After about a minute or so in flight, I noticed the l.e.d. blinking, but never lost control. It did this with all 3 flights. Steady on for about a minute, then started to blink, but again, never lost control of the heli. For safety sake, I think I will just get another rx for it as I don't trust it. I never had any of my other helis do this.
Scott, now I am more confused as I have heard nothing but bad about CC electronics. As far as I know, everybody has pretty much completely abandoned CC due to extremely high failure rates. If you are having good luck with the Align esc's, then I will likely just get one of them for the Blackhawk.
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Post by dunkonu23 on May 17, 2010 8:47:16 GMT -5
My experience with CC stuff is completely different. I have an ICE 75 and a straight 60 ESC with their external BEC and everything has performed flawlessly. I'm thinking people underbought or didn't know what they were doing when they programmed their ESC's. Many pros use them and have no issue.
I just wanted to be clear on it. I have had no ESC failures with either Align or Castle.
Scott
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Post by Jerrymac on May 18, 2010 0:19:10 GMT -5
My experience with CC stuff is completely different. I have an ICE 75 and a straight 60 ESC with their external BEC and everything has performed flawlessly. I'm thinking people underbought or didn't know what they were doing when they programmed their ESC's. Many pros use them and have no issue. I just wanted to be clear on it. I have had no ESC failures with either Align or Castle. Scott Hey Scott, you could be right about maybe people just didn't have a large enough esc or not programmed right. I didn't really think about that, only that I have heard lots of guys complain about the CC failures. What size esc are you using on your 450 Pro? Reason I ask is the one that quit on the BH450 was a 35A, and I am wondering if I need something a little bigger, or if it was just time for the old one to go. If you are using the Align 35A then I think it would work fine in my BH too. Mine was the stock one that came with the heli. Still confused about the rx l.e.d blinking too. Today I spooled it up in the yard, but didn't actually lift it off the ground. Left it sit there at about half throttle for 4 min. and it was ok. Put another battery in and did the same for about 1 minute and it was ok, then took off and flew around the yard a couple times and noticed the led started blinking again. I think I will start by checking all my connections and make sure that nothing is loose. |
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Post by dunkonu23 on May 18, 2010 1:01:10 GMT -5
My experience with CC stuff is completely different. I have an ICE 75 and a straight 60 ESC with their external BEC and everything has performed flawlessly. I'm thinking people underbought or didn't know what they were doing when they programmed their ESC's. Many pros use them and have no issue. I just wanted to be clear on it. I have had no ESC failures with either Align or Castle. Scott Hey Scott, you could be right about maybe people just didn't have a large enough esc or not programmed right. I didn't really think about that, only that I have heard lots of guys complain about the CC failures. What size esc are you using on your 450 Pro? Reason I ask is the one that quit on the BH450 was a 35A, and I am wondering if I need something a little bigger, or if it was just time for the old one to go. If you are using the Align 35A then I think it would work fine in my BH too. Mine was the stock one that came with the heli. Still confused about the rx l.e.d blinking too. Today I spooled it up in the yard, but didn't actually lift it off the ground. Left it sit there at about half throttle for 4 min. and it was ok. Put another battery in and did the same for about 1 minute and it was ok, then took off and flew around the yard a couple times and noticed the led started blinking again. I think I will start by checking all my connections and make sure that nothing is loose. I have this in my 450 pro: RCE-BL35X 35A Brushless ESC Absolutely no issues with it either. The blinking is odd. Spektrum says LOS will not cause the light to blink... so I think we're safe there. Maybe the battery connectors are worn or pitted? Scott |
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Post by dunkonu23 on May 18, 2010 1:58:25 GMT -5
You know, there's actually another reason why those ESC's may have gotten a bad rep.
The vocal minority. I'm of the feeling that people complain loudly on forums. I know there were complaints about Castle's ESC's after a software upgrade, but only by a few people. I never had a single problem. I just went my merry way. Then again, I'm not an early adopter. I wait until dust settles, then if I pull the trigger or wait until the next upgrade.
Scott
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Post by Jerrymac on May 18, 2010 2:40:27 GMT -5
Hey Scott, another question if you don't mind. What was it that Eddie was talking about over on the "struggling" thread about his Align esc's going into programming mode each time they are plugged in. I am a little confused about what he was referring to, or, is it that maybe he is a little confused about the initial tones.
I always trust your advice, as you know, so I will probably just get a 35A Align esc to put in the BH 450, but a little confused about what Eddie was talking about.
I guess it is just normal for people to speak loudly when they have a problem, I know I do sometimes too, but many say nothing when all is good. I try to do both.
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Post by dunkonu23 on May 18, 2010 3:41:54 GMT -5
I dunno... mine don't do that unless I want it to do it. He may be talking about the beeps after it initializes that tell you the options you have set.
Scott
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Post by billmay on May 18, 2010 21:30:13 GMT -5
The blinking is odd. Spektrum says LOS will not cause the light to blink... so I think we're safe there. Maybe the battery connectors are worn or pitted? Scott Scott, Spektrum DOES say that loss of signal or a power drop will cause the newer RX's to flash. See here: www.spektrumrc.com/Community/InstallationBestPractices.aspxCheck the link that says "look into the source of flashing receiver lights" Bill |
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Post by Jerrymac on May 19, 2010 0:20:28 GMT -5
There is some good reading in there Bill, but I still did not see anything about a loss-of-signal. Only a loss of voltage, below 3.2 volts, unless I missed it somewhere. The flight log data section, explains monitoring for fades and frame losses, but it does not say that the led will flash if a frame loss is encountered. That was why I thought maybe I have a bad or loose connection somewhere, I dunno. |
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Post by Jerrymac on May 19, 2010 0:25:07 GMT -5
I dunno... mine don't do that unless I want it to do it. He may be talking about the beeps after it initializes that tell you the options you have set. Scott Yeah, that is what I was thinking too, but was a little confused the way he said it. All of my helis make an initial tone from the motor when the esc is plugged in. |
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Post by dunkonu23 on May 19, 2010 1:50:27 GMT -5
The blinking is odd. Spektrum says LOS will not cause the light to blink... so I think we're safe there. Maybe the battery connectors are worn or pitted? Scott Scott, Spektrum DOES say that loss of signal or a power drop will cause the newer RX's to flash. See here: www.spektrumrc.com/Community/InstallationBestPractices.aspxCheck the link that says "look into the source of flashing receiver lights" Bill I didn't read it that way, Bill. Granted, there will be a signal loss if you lose power, but it doesn't say the lights will flash if you ONLY lose signal. Now, this is the odd thing.. I have read that the only real way to detect signal loss is if you use their Flight log device. If it were me, I'd have designed a frame loss indicator into the receiver. I don't know the format of packets, but I would assume they have a count that can be used to detect out of order packets as well as dropped packets (for the latter they could use frame times, but that's more work than simply comparing incoming and last packet headers). I dunno. Scott |
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