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Post by dunkonu23 on Jun 26, 2011 2:26:37 GMT -5
Here's what is literally the first flight of my FBL HeadHunter... Nothing more than 8's. I was getting used to it, but that's over, now.
Scott
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Post by Jerrymac on Jun 26, 2011 3:36:21 GMT -5
Nice and smooth bro. Was it you, or was it BeastX, lol. You can't make me go FBL, my wallet is way too light.  As hard as I try to fly nice smooth circuits, I always seem to get some quick jerky inputs at times, especially when I reverse the direction of the flight. I noticed your 8's were always turning away from you, is it just as smooth flying 8's in the other direction, turning towards you? At my age I am not really interested in learning hard 3D flying, just nice smooth circuits. Backwards flight still give me lots of trouble though. I can fly backwards turning toward me, but always dumb thumb turning away from me. Same with rolls, I can roll right, but always mess up when trying to roll left.  |
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Post by dunkonu23 on Jun 26, 2011 9:21:45 GMT -5
Truth be told, probably a little of me and a little of the BeastX, Jerry. I mean, you point the thing and it holds, that's the BeastX part. The me part is that you still have to know how to point it. I can turn into myself, so that's not a problem. With first full flights like that one, I take no chances because I want to be able to recover if something goes wrong. Like yesterday, I was flying my T-Rex 450pro and suddenly it started making chattering noises and the tail went irratic. A tail drive gear lost a couple of teeth... so I had to get it back when the tail was kicking 90 degrees randomly. So, at first, I fly where I can recover.
That flight looks pretty slow until you look at the ground that was covered. I took up the whole soccer field and then some, until towards the end when I got more comfortable.
Edit... I'm just learning how to fly backward on the sim only. I can do tail slides, but why risk the helicopter when I'm not 100% confident? Same story for inverted flight. Rolling and flipping I can do. I haven't done rolls and flips with my FBL helicopters, yet though.
So, I guess the real question is this: IS FBL easier? Yes and no. It's easier to maintain control because you don't have to correct all the time, but again, you have to know what to control. It's not like you're coming in off the street with an FBL helicopter and start flying it.
I am going to be converting all my helicopters to FBL, though. Seriously.
Scott
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Post by Jerrymac on Jun 26, 2011 16:07:32 GMT -5
Thank's for explaining a little bit about how the FBL differs Scott. I see lots of arguments concerning flybar vs fbl, but no information, just argument, lol.
I just noticed that in both your 450 pro vid and your HH vid that the helicopters flew very smoothly. Not taking away from your flying ability, but I know how hard it is to fly constant back to back 8's and keep them so smooth. So, I am guessing that the fbl unit helps to keep the helicopter more stable during flight, and loosing the fly bar gives more response.
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Post by dunkonu23 on Jun 26, 2011 17:05:31 GMT -5
Yeah, people argue about stuff like that all the time. I dunno why. I suppose they just like to argue for the sake of arguing. The Spektrum quality vs Futaba threads everywhere remind me constantly of that. I got into one a while back, made my point and stopped.
What the FBL unit does is keep the helicopter controlled as you want. You want to go straight up, punch it. You want to lean, use aileron and it will lean where you stop it until you either change your mind or crash. It does fight wind changes in attitude for the same reason... you told it where you wanted it and while it will blow from side to side/up and down, it won't roll, pitch up, or pitch down. Collectively in wind, it's the same. If the helicopter is leaning or pitched up, it will move with wind, but the FBL unit will try to keep the attitude to you desire. Chances are, you'll have to correct.
Scott
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Post by Jerrymac on Jun 26, 2011 22:38:30 GMT -5
Thank you sir. The main reason I ask all the questions concerning FBL is that, although my heli budget won't let me go that route on all my helicopters, I would like to put a scale fuse on my plastic framed 550 and try to fit a 4 blade rotor head on it, and an FLB controller.
I am guessing from what you said that this kind of configuration would probably work out pretty well. I am not sure the fbl unit was designed for running a 4 blade rotor head, but, that is what I am going to try. Hopefully it will help maintain a nice stable, realistic, scale flight, I dunno.
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Post by dunkonu23 on Jun 26, 2011 23:55:11 GMT -5
Jerry,
The Mikado unit has compensation for the phasing issues more than two blades presents. It's actually in the advanced swash settings. You can electronically adjust phasing. Mr. Mel says it's for FBL scale heads and heads where phasing is not adjustable.
Scott
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Post by dunkonu23 on Jul 8, 2011 23:36:59 GMT -5
Jerry,
Take a listen to the noise the helicopter is making after I go to Idle 2. If can, venture a guess as to what it is. I've readjusted gear mesh again tonight and will test it tomorrow. After that, I start throwing parts at it. Starting with the tail.
Thanks, bro!
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Post by Jerrymac on Jul 9, 2011 14:02:50 GMT -5
Scott,
I am not really sure which noise you are talking about, except that the noise at around 1:20 sounds very familiar. My HeadHunter 500 made a very similar noise in fff when I had the 84.5mm tail blades on it. I flew it fast once very close in front of me to get a better idea of the noise and I could actually see the tail wagging violently back and forth, although only a very small amount, if that makes sense.
It looked like it was only moving back and forth a few mm, but it was doing it so fast it sounded more like a vibration. I fiddled with the gain but it didn't help. When I put the smaller 70mm tail blades on it, the noise went away, and the tail was much smoother. I use the stock 79mm tail blades on my 550 with no issues.
EDIT: I forgot to mention that I made a couple of quick passes with the gyro in rate mode and it didn't make that noise, so that is why I started with the tail.
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Post by dunkonu23 on Jul 9, 2011 15:10:47 GMT -5
Cool, Jerry. I'm talking about the difference in noise between idle 1 and idle 2. I switched it pretty quick. Today, I pulled the tension pulley on the tail assembly because it really doesn't do anything... I checked it. I'm thinking I'll try smaller blades if this doesn't work. Thanks for taking the time to listen, Jerry.
Scott
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Post by dunkonu23 on Jul 9, 2011 20:27:57 GMT -5
Here's another one... this time there is a component failure resulting in a crash. Quick inspection revealed a broken elevator servo arm, but I can't be sure. I'll also look at the ESC log to see if there was a power failure. It sure acted like it went into failsafe.
Scott
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Post by Jerrymac on Jul 9, 2011 23:48:14 GMT -5
Dang, that sucks Scott. How bad was the damage? It is always hard to tell in a video, but it looked/sounded to me like a mechanical failure. The blade noise just before it went in sounds like the controller was trying to correct but couldn't due to a mechanical problem.
Hope the damage wasn't too bad.
Jerry
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Post by dunkonu23 on Jul 10, 2011 0:21:02 GMT -5
Jerry,
The damage was extensive. I've posted a list of the parts so far on RCU. Additionally, a few minutes ago, I found the left cyclic servo has been scraped pretty badly as it slid across the road. Also, the head block is bent.
Ever had an antirotation pin slide out of the antirotation bracket? It's looking like that was the cause. However, it could have happened when the post was struck.
At best, I could convert the Flybarred HeadHunter to FBL if the microbeast survived the crash.
Scott
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Post by dunkonu23 on Jul 10, 2011 1:07:40 GMT -5
Damage so far:
In addition to the above...
Grip arms, feathering shaft, blades, boom, landing gear mounts, struts, tubes, battery plate, battery, receiver (cracked), canopy, canopy mounts, swash driver, tail blades, tail hub, tail output shaft, tail servo (mounting tabs broken off), horizontal stab, vertical stab, front main gear, rear main gear.
Scott
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Post by ptcaflyer on Jul 10, 2011 2:07:19 GMT -5
...That one hurt just looking at it in the video...
I has some spare stuff if you need anything !
PT
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Post by Jerrymac on Jul 10, 2011 3:50:12 GMT -5
Damn bro, That REALLY sucks. Seems like the frame and motor is all that survived huh? I suppose the easiest way to go would be to convert the FB HeadHunter to FBL, BUT, I know you are like me and just won't be able to stand that crashed helicopter sitting there. My grandson is just learning to hover well, but keeps crashing the King 2's and I keep telling myself that I am not rebuilding them any more. After looking at those poor little crashed K2's laying on their side, I end up rebuilding them for him. I know your situation is different, as you wanted to convert all of your helis to FBL, but sacrificing one for another just doesn't sound like the Scott that I know. Of course, whatever you decide is all good as long as you have one of your HeadHunter Helis in the air. BTW, I have never had an anti-rotation pin come out of the bracket, but, knowing the mechanics of an RC helicopter, I can see how that would cause a lot of damage when the swash plate rotated. I hate to see/hear about crashes, but unfortunately it is a part of the hobby. I hope it doesn't discourage you Scott, as you have been tearing up the sky the last couple of weeks. I have enjoyed seeing your new found confidence this season. Jerry |
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Post by dunkonu23 on Jul 10, 2011 14:10:03 GMT -5
...That one hurt just looking at it in the video... I has some spare stuff if you need anything ! PT Thanks, man. I appreciate it. Spares aren't the problem right now, but if I need spares, I'll let you know. I need to find the cause. Looking at that video closely and listening to what a helicopter sounds like when the pros are doing autorotation/recovery moves, it sounds like I lost power. That means I need to use Goop on all connectors to the receiver and/or flybarless unit. Funnier still, I bought some Friday and didn't put it on. Jerry... Everything in the frame except the battery mount survived just fine. I hear you about rebuilding, but I'm thinking it's best to just convert the Flybar HeadHunter to FBL and leave it at that. I wanted to have two at IRCHA, but that's just not going to happen. I'm scrapping the crashed helicopter. That was Ben's original CF frame, too. Good deal on your grandson. You know he's gonna get good quick!  You're a good grandfather to keep rebuilding! Looks like I'm changing. I've got a perfectly good HH sitting here doing nothing so I might as well make use of it. My confidence is going to be just fine. While the cause may have been my fault, I did everything right flying wise, so I'm still just as confident. Thanks for the encouragement, bro! Scott |
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Post by Jerrymac on Jul 10, 2011 15:21:15 GMT -5
Well, I hope the BeastX survived the crash and your new conversion goes smoothly.
If nothing else, I guess it shows how strong the HH frame is since it didn't suffer much damage. It kind of sucks though when you don't know for certain, what actually caused the crash, since most of the damage occurs at impact.
Most of my crashes are due to pilot error so they are easy to figure out, lol.
Good luck with your new conversion.
Jerry
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Post by dunkonu23 on Jul 10, 2011 15:30:01 GMT -5
Thanks, bro. I'm going to start on the conversion tomorrow, after PT. I hope the microbeast survived, too. If not, I'm screwed. I need to get new batteries and another set of batteries for my F6, too. I also want to get new batteries for my T-rex 500. So, money is a problem. I'll figure it out, but man... it's something I didn't need and something I probably could have avoided if I put goop on the connectors. Guess what's happening tonight on all my helicopters? Scott |
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Post by Jerrymac on Jul 10, 2011 15:57:45 GMT -5
I hear you on the batteries Scott. I just spent quite a bit this year for a bunch of new 6s 2650's for the HeadHunter, and a bunch of 3s 2200's for the BH450. My original 3300's for the Hurri 550 are 3 years old now and get a little puffy after a flight, so those will be next, but hoping they will last this season and I can replace them next spring.
Fortunately, the 6s 2650's also work fine in my Hurri 425 so at least they can "share", lol.
Jerry
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You're a good grandfather to keep rebuilding!